Mit Schnitte  #1
/ Mit Anja Majer Esther Ernst bei Larissa Fassler

Für ihre Gesprächsreihe „Mit Schnitte“ besuchen die Künstlerinnen Anja Majer und Esther Ernst Kollegen und Kolleginnen am Tag nach ihrer Vernissage und laden sie zu einer mitgebrachten Schnitte und zum Gespräch über das Phänomen der Eröffnung im Allgemeinen und den vergangenen Abend im Speziellen ein.
„Mit Schnitte #1“ ist ein Gespräch mit der kanadischen Künstlerin Larissa Fassler über die Vernissage der Ausstellung „Urbanität mal anders – Künstlerische Projekte zur ästhetischen Stadtforschung“, die am 03. 8.2013 in der Galerie am Körnerpark in Berlin-Neukölln stattfand.

Anja Majer  /       Ja, schön, dass es geklappt hat mit dem Gespräch und wir freuen uns, dich zu Hause zu besuchen. Also, wir waren gestern absichtlich nicht bei deiner Eröffnung, weil wir unmittelbar danach und anhand dieses Gesprächs herausfinden möchten, wie du deine eigene Vernissage erlebt hast. Weil das ja eben eine ganz spezielle Situation ist, wenn Künstler und Werk zum ersten Mal zusammen in der Öffentlichkeit sind. Eine Zäsur im Arbeitsprozess. Ein Anfangs- und ein Endpunkt sozusagen.
Du hattest per Mail bereits geschrieben, dass diese Eröffnung für dich speziell wie ein Anfangs- und  Endpunkt ist, weil du zwei ältere Arbeiten zeigst (Prints von Zeichnungen, „Kotti 2008“ und „Kotti (revisited)“ aus 2010) und eine Arbeit über den Schlossplatz, die wirklich erst am Anfang ist.
Larissa Fassler  /       Ja, ich zeige meine bisherigen Recherchen über den Berliner Schlossplatz. Es ist so, dass ich meinen Atelierraum in die Galerie transferiert habe. So it’s interesting. This year I’ve shown a lot of older work and last night was the first time that I had the chance to show something that the public hadn’t seen yet. So it actually felt like one of the more exciting openings that I’ve done in ages. With older works, they’ve been talked about a lot, so you often already know how they are perceived. It’s much more exciting when there is a bit of risk involved. I like when you place works in a space for the first time and a lot of new questions arise. Instantly you see things that you didn’t see in the studio.
Esther Ernst  /       Warum ist das so, dass man in der Ausstellungspräsentation anders sieht? Ist es die Distanz der anderen Räume, die einen neuen Blick aufmacht?
Fassler  /       Ja, maybe because you have to react to a new room. I think at one point you say: Okay, the work is finished. I’m showing it. And then you look at it in the new space and think: Aha, it’s not finished. I don’t know, there is a break from atelier to the exhibition space that changes the work. And it was the same last night with the research. What is the line between having the research so clean that it becomes an artwork in itself versus having it in a rougher state? I don’t want to create theatre either: I don’t want to pretend that it’s my atelier. So there’s a funny little line – What’s real? What am I trying to present? What am I trying to show?
Majer  /       Hast Du manchmal das Gefühl, du brauchst nochmal eine kurze Zeit vor der Eröffnung allein mit der Arbeit? Also dass du früher kommst und nochmal schaust?
Fassler  /       No, not on the day of the Vernissage. That happens during the whole week of the Aufbau. I spend a lot of time just sitting and looking at the work. The day of the opening I find I’m slightly nervous all day and I kind of just want it to start. I’m thinking about how the work will be received, what my peers will think and the general public. I’m interested in seeing afresh some of the choices I’ve made and I am already anticipating some of the criticism. And there are a lot of professional things that are going on during the whole evening as well.
Ernst  /       Wie war das denn gestern Abend, wenn du sagst, dass du mit verschiedenen Arbeiten beschäftigt bist: Also Konversation zu führen, professionelle aber auch freundschaftliche, ein bisschen genießen, aber auch diszipliniert sein... Sprichst du dich normalerweise mit dem Galeristen ab, wie ihr den Abend gestaltet?
Fassler  /       Ja, also gestern Abend Oliver, my gallerist from SEPTEMBER, needed to be there, because there was a potential buyer that we’ve been courting for months, who wanted to see the new work and wanted to talk. And that’s what I talk through with Oliver first: Who’s in Berlin? Who needs to come by? I also do invitations independently of the gallery. So I have my own mailing list and I invite people who I’m interested in seeing and showing the work to. Last night I invited two of the curators that I had recently had studio visits with and who hadn’t yet seen the work installed. I target certain people and ask them to come. And then, of course, I make sure that I speak with all these people.
Ernst  /       Das klingt, als wärst du sehr fokussiert und konzentriert und würdest dich nicht sofort betrinken.
Fassler  /       (lacht) Oh no, a little bit of wine helps. No, I found the evening quite enjoyable because I had the chance to speak with some really interesting people who are also working on similar lines of thought. Some of the exchanges are business, definitely, and so of course, I’m keeping in mind: charming, flattering, interesting, all of that – but actually you can let that go and just fall into an interesting conversation. Which feels better.
I find that I now use openings differently compared to, say four years ago. I’m more confident in my work so I feel more open to talking about it – even if it’s a critique or even if someone doesn’t like the work much. Criticism doesn’t shake me to my core anymore, so I can talk about it.
Ernst  /       Hörst du wirklich Kritik auf Eröffnungen?
Fassler  /       Ja, in meinem Freundeskreis. Und von anderen Künstlern. Not from general public. Nothing too hard, a questioning of the use of a material for example. With some questions you can hear the critique implied.
Ernst  /       Und jetzt zu der alles entscheidenden Frage: Was hattest du denn gestern an?
Fassler  /       I had on a black mini skirt, black t-shirt, heels – the gallery is located in an elegant Orangerie, so I thought I’d fit the place. A lot of people came in summer dresses.
Majer  /       Hast du ganz generell bestimmte Vernissagen-Outfits?
Fassler  /       Ja, I do. It’s funny with aufmerksam und nicht aufmerksam machen. Because I don’t like standing out normally, but to wear clothes that would totally make me disappear would also be ridiculous – you can’t hide. So I’ve got some favourite things that I feel super comfortable in, that I know look nice. I also don’t want to dress up to the point where I start feeling uncomfortable. That’s the last thing I need.
It was funny, I had an opening in Paris and I asked the gallerist what level of dress was expected, because I don’t know Paris openings. In Berlin you can go in anything. In Paris, NO. I mean, he said, whatever, but I like to somehow fit in a bit. I can’t be outrageous. It’s not me.
Majer  /       Würdest du sagen, dass du, nicht nur bei deiner eigenen Vernissage, sondern auch, wenn du zu anderen gehst, eher professionell als privat unterwegs bist?
Fassler  /       Ja, but I think openings are also a nice chance to see people I haven’t seen in ages. Pascal, my husband, and I were talking about that recently. He feels, as he gets older, his social circle is getting smaller. Whereas with artists, it’s this really bizarre thing with openings that there is a party happening every week where I can go if I want to talk to people. And the conversations can go from anything, from gossip to actually interesting ideas, to whatever. I find it interesting that in the art scene there’s this constant social interaction available that one can be a part of. It’s good because otherwise I’m in my studio where I spend the majority of my time alone.
Ernst  /       Wenn du „Kotti 2008“ als Print wieder aufhängst und zeigst, ist das so eine Art Wiedersehensfreude?
Fassler  /       Sometimes, yes. But I also find that that work is now five years old and I feel like I have developed and learned so much since then. I want to do so many more things with drawing and when I look at that work, it feels much older. I think „Kotti 2008“ is a fine work but with the new work I want to go much further.
Majer  /       Und hast du gestern mehr über die älteren Arbeiten oder mehr über die neue gesprochen?
Fassler  /       Both. The new research is a good way to enter into the old work as well. It offers some insight into the different stages of research that go into making my drawings. With the new research though, it’s fun to talk about where it might go. It’s difficult, describing what you might do in the future, because when I say things like I want to be more abstract or to push and pull shapes – I think what a viewer is imagining and I’m imagining is probably quite different.
Majer  /       Die Situation gestern Abend hört sich so an, als ob sie etwas von einem Ateliergespräch hatte? Man zeigt etwas, aber es ist auch eine sehr viel intimere Situation als eine Eröffnung.
Fassler  /       Ja, I have a feeling last night ran like a whole bunch of little studio visits. I think people were really engaged in talking about the work because it was so much about process rather than being about looking at finished pieces. The whole show yesterday was about Stadtforschung, process, and research and the conversations were engaging.
Ernst  /       Gehst du die Gespräche am nächsten Tag nochmal durch?
Fassler  /       Ja, sometimes. If I think I said too much … (lacht) … which might happen here as well.
Majer  /       Und hast du nach der Eröffnung so etwas wie ein Premierenloch wenn die ganze Anspannung abfällt?
Fassler  /       Maybe when new pieces are finished. But I think it’s different in this case, because I’m at such a beginning point. Talking about the work yesterday evening actually got me really excited to continue.
Ernst  /       Gab es schon mal Momente wo die Vernissage oder der Aufbau schon so schrecklich war, dass du gleich nach der Eröffnung deine Arbeiten am liebsten wieder mit nach Hause genommen hättest?
Fassler  /       No, I’ve never had that bad an experience, but I can think of other kinds of moments. At the Kleine Humboldt Galerie, for example, it’s young, young curators there. They are all 24-, 26-year-old art historians. The show was really good but at that opening, it was all clearly their crowd. It was great to have a piece in such a strong show, the exhibition was very good, but I was relatively anonymous in the crowd that evening. The curators were very excited about their show and it was kind of their show. Actually I’ve experienced that same situation in a much more extreme way. At the beginning of the year I was included in a big show in Mexico City – that was a curator show! I was the bystander. They almost forgot to invite me to the dinner afterwards. It was their research, it was their names, it was their book. And it felt like we, the artists, were just illustrations of their theory. A strange feeling.
Ernst  /       Und gibt es, um zum Schluss zu kommen, etwas, das du an einer Vernissage wahnsinnig gern tun würdest, dich aber nicht traust?
Fassler  /       No. (lacht) I just try to survive. Sometimes they’re comfortable and fine and fun and sometimes it’s just about survival.